Legislative Assembly of Ontario · House

Tuesday, November 3, 2026

The official record of the sitting, from Hansard, by section and topic. Passages link to the Assembly’s video of Members’ Statements and Question Period where it is posted.

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Members’ Statements

Addiction services

10:23 a.m.Official Hansard

MPP Catherine McKenney

New documents obtained by Le Droit and reported out yesterday show that this Conservative government was warned about the risks related to the closure of supervised consumption sites. On March 30, 2025, the day before nine sites were forced to close—and in the case of Somerset West Community Health Centre, backed by knowingly false data—the Premier’s office and health minister were briefed by their very own ministry. The staff at the site and at other nearby community health centres and the closest hospital had all warned that they might not be able to handle the increased demand and that the closure would put emergency and front-line services at risk. The health minister was told that clients of another health centre here in Toronto had already started opening their own homes as de facto consumption sites. Those homes will include apartments and rooms in dense neighbourhoods with no health care available—and will likely be close to schools and parks. But that evidently was never the real concern. The minister knew all of this, and she closed the sites anyway. The government didn’t respond to those warnings, and it still won’t answer questions about them. This was never about evidence. People in my community are paying the price for a decision that was made against expert advice. This scandal-ridden government owes Ottawa Centre an explanation. An independent review of the effects of the closures must be conducted in order to restore any remaining faith in this government.

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Government investments

10:24 a.m.Official Hansard

Hon. Laurie Scott

Speaker, I rise today to share some good news for my riding of Haliburton–Kawartha Lakes–Brock. Our rural communities are wonderful places to live, work, and raise a family, but we know that strong communities don’t happen by chance. They depend on access to key services, opportunities for youth, and investments that support families and growth. Recently, our government announced another increase in land ambulance funding, ensuring our residents have timely access to care. Through the primary care action plan, 15,000 residents across Haliburton–Kawartha Lakes–Brock will be connected to a primary care team, improving access to health care close to home. We are also supporting the next generation of health care professionals. With the expansion of the Ontario Learn and Stay Grant—nursing and paramedicine programs at Trent University and Fleming College. This program reduces financial barriers and encourages graduates to build careers in the communities that need them the most. I recently attended the groundbreaking for the Trillium Lakelands District School Board’s new outdoor and Indigenous education centre in Minden. This centre will offer students hands-on learning opportunities in nature, which helps deepen their understanding of Indigenous perspectives. Speaker, whether it’s expanding access to health care, supporting future professionals or creating new learning opportunities, these investments all contribute to building stronger, more connected rural communities.

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Anti-Semitism

10:26 a.m.Official Hansard

Ms. Laura Smith

Last month, after the Jewish High Holidays, I visited the Sons of Jacob synagogue in Belleville. Unfortunately, I did not go to celebrate Rosh Hashanah, Yom Kippur or Sukkot; I went there to meet members of the congregation in solidarity and support after they faced a targeted, anti-Semitic and hate-motivated mass shooting attempt. Thankfully, Constables Jeff Smith and Michael McCurdy fought off the shooter, with Smith suffering multiple injuries while protecting the 25 congregants inside. This is just one example of the hate and evil that continues to exist. Despite Jewish Canadians being less than 2% of the population, post-October 7, anti-Semitic incidents have spiked, accounting for 40% of reported hate crimes. That is why our government has continued to take real action, making Holocaust education mandatory and strengthening our grade 6 social studies and grade 10 Canadian history curriculums to deepen students’ understanding of the Holocaust and the lasting effects of anti-Semitism. Last week, Officer Smith was released from the hospital. We are so grateful to both Smith and McCurdy for their bravery. This Holocaust Education Week, we remember the six million Jews who were murdered simply for who they were and the 25 in Belleville who are still here because of the bravery of those two police officers. Now, more than ever, we have to double down. If we don’t learn from the past, we are doomed to repeat it.

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Electoral reform

10:28 a.m.Official Hansard

Ms. Bobbi Ann Brady

Last Monday, municipal councils were elected across Ontario, and in Norfolk county, we saw an unusual turn of events. In ward 4, two candidates, Jeni Lambert and incumbent Chris Van Paassen, received exactly 858 votes. I understand that ties can happen. The legislation provides for an automatic recount to ensure every vote is accurately counted. But what happens if the recount still produces a tie? Well, according to section 62(3) of the Municipal Elections Act, 1996, the successful candidate is chosen by lot. In other words, we put two names in a hat and we draw one out. This is 2026. At a time when technology has transformed how we conduct elections, I find it difficult to accept that the outcome of a democratic election could ultimately come down to a lottery. Voter apathy is already a real concern. We should be doing everything we can do to strengthen public confidence in our democratic institutions, not introduce another reason for people to question the process. Democracy should be determined by the voters, not by a coin toss or a name drawn from a hat. That’s why, this morning, I will table a motion calling on the government to modernize the Municipal Elections Act and remove this outdated provision. Surely, in 2026, we can come up with a better way to resolve a tie than leaving the outcome to chance.

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Introduction of Visitors

10:30 a.m.Official Hansard

The Speaker (Hon. Donna Skelly)

We have with us in the Speaker’s gallery today a cohort of interns from the Parliament of Canada’s Parliamentary Internship Programme. They are here to learn about Ontario’s Legislature and meet with their counterparts in the Ontario Legislature Internship Programme. Please join me in warmly welcoming our guests to the Legislature.

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10:30 a.m.Official Hansard

The Speaker (Hon. Donna Skelly)

Members, if I could have your attention, please. The year is 1981. Canada’s Wonderland opens its gates. Interest rates are 22%. And Bill Davis wins a massive majority. Sitting in the media gallery is a cameraman with a full head of hair, who would go on to cover nine Premiers: Davis, Miller, Peterson, Rae, Harris, Eves, McGuinty, Wynne and Ford. This week, CHCH-TV’s Randy Rath celebrates 45 years here at Queen’s Park, making him the longest-serving current member of the press gallery. Randy, from all of us here at the Ontario Legislature, congratulations. Thank you for the work you do, your sense of humour and friendship. I love you from the bottom of my heart.

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10:31 a.m.Official Hansard

Hon. Kevin Holland

Joining us from Thunder Bay in the House today is Dr. Donald Young and Dr. Gerald Smith. Welcome.

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10:31 a.m.Official Hansard

MPP Kristyn Wong-Tam

I’m very proud to rise and to recognize a number of esteemed guests we have in the House. Ted Garrard, Patsy Anderson, Dr. Peter Szatmari and Priscilla Ofosu-Barko are all here for Capitalize for Kids. Their reception took place this morning. From the Ontario Dental Association, we have Dr. Lynn Tomkins, Dr. David Ho and Dr. Jaclyn Chin. Lisa Philipps is the interim president and vice-chancellor of York University. And from the Ontario Federation of Indigenous Friendship Centres, we are joined by CEO Sean Longboat as well as president Armand Jourdain Sr. Welcome to your House.

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10:32 a.m.Official Hansard

Ms. Marit Stiles

I want to join my colleague in welcoming board president Armand Jourdain Sr., CEO Sean Longboat, and everyone joining us on behalf of the Ontario Federation of Indigenous Friendship Centres. I look forward to meeting with you this afternoon. Welcome to your House.

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10:32 a.m.Official Hansard

Hon. Greg Rickford

My very talented policy analyst Katherine Hunt joins us in this magnificent place.

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10:32 a.m.Official Hansard

Hon. Michael Parsa

I’d like to welcome the members of the Ontario Federation of Indigenous Friendship Centres and the friendship centre movement: president Armand Jourdain Sr., CEO Sean Longboat, and the entire team. Thank you very much for hosting us this morning. Welcome to Queen’s Park.

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10:33 a.m.Official Hansard

Hon. David Piccini

I’d like to welcome Alex Tinker, mother of page Robert, who’s here from our riding, following in the footsteps of Katherine. It’s a family affair of pages here. Welcome to Queen’s Park.

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10:33 a.m.Official Hansard

Ms. Mary-Margaret McMahon

I’d like to welcome two fantastic dentists from the Ontario Dental Association: Dr. Lily Zhang and Dr. David Stevenson. Welcome to your House. Please excuse my candy bar in my office.

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10:33 a.m.Official Hansard

Mr. Adil Shamji

This morning, I’d like to welcome to the House the Ontario Federation of Indigenous Friendship Centres, the Ontario Dental Association, as well as Life Sciences Ontario. Welcome.

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10:33 a.m.Official Hansard

MPP Alexa Gilmour

Today I’d like to welcome Angela and the whole team from Capitalize for Kids, the 20-plus organizations serving our youth and their mental health needs. Welcome to your House.

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10:34 a.m.Official Hansard

Mrs. Michelle Cooper

I’m pleased to welcome Angela Simo Brown, not only from Capitalize for Kids, but from my riding of Eglinton–Lawrence—a national charity dedicated to improving child and youth mental wellness. Welcome to Queen’s Park.

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10:34 a.m.Official Hansard

Hon. Steve Clark

I’d like to welcome to the Legislature Dr. Lance McIntosh and Dr. Homa Jammehdiabadi. Welcome to Queen’s Park.

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10:34 a.m.Official Hansard

Hon. Rob Flack

I’d like to welcome Dr. Edward Busvek, the Ontario Dental Association’s president-elect, from St. Thomas, Ontario.

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10:34 a.m.Official Hansard

Mr. Mike Schreiner

It’s an honour to introduce Anne Dyck, today’s page captain, and welcome her parents, Sarah Westmacott and Paul Dyck, who are here to see her perform her duties today. I’d also like to welcome everybody from the Ontario Dental Association, especially Dr. Maneesh Jain from Guelph.

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10:35 a.m.Official Hansard

Ms. Chandra Pasma

I’d like to welcome, from Ottawa West–Nepean, Dr. Isha Moza and Dr. Lance McIntosh from the Ontario Dental Association, and also, from the Parliamentary Internship Programme, director Paul Thomas, a long-time friend.

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10:35 a.m.Official Hansard

MPP Lisa Gretzky

I would like to welcome a Windsor dentist, Dr. Charles Frank, who is here with the ODA. Welcome to Queen’s Park.

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10:35 a.m.Official Hansard

Mr. Stephen Blais

I’d like to welcome dentists from Orléans and across Ottawa who are with us today from the Ontario Dental Association: Dr. Isha Moza, Dr. Sherif Elsaraj and Dr. David Schooley. I look forward to our meeting this afternoon.

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10:35 a.m.Official Hansard

Hon. Nina Tangri

I’d like to welcome Dr. Cyril Tahtadjian here at Queen’s Park, from Mississauga–Streetsville, with all of the Ontario Dental Association.

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10:36 a.m.Official Hansard

Mr. Tyler Allsopp

It’s my pleasure to introduce Dr. Matti from my riding, who’s here with the Ontario Dental Association. I’ve never flossed harder.

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10:36 a.m.Official Hansard

Mr. Anthony Leardi

Welcome, from the Ontario Dental Association, Dr. Leith, Dr. Bentley, Dr. Frank, Dr. Silverman, Dr. Dwyer from Essex county, and CEO Frank Bevilacqua.

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10:36 a.m.Official Hansard

Ms. Peggy Sattler

I’m delighted to welcome Dr. Brock Nicolucci, who’s here with the ODA, from London West.

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10:36 a.m.Official Hansard

Mr. Terence Kernaghan

It gives me great pleasure to welcome Dr. Peter Fendrich and Dr. Edward Busvek with the Ontario Dental Association. I look forward to our meeting. I would also like to welcome Ken Hughes, Emily Beduz, Mark Jeddi and Monte Lamka from Life Sciences Ontario. I also look forward to our meeting.

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10:37 a.m.Official Hansard

The Speaker (Hon. Donna Skelly)

Unfortunately, that’s all the time we have. Please come back at 1 o’clock if you have other introductions of visitors. But I would like to mention that joining us today is Phil Gillies, the representative for Brantford in the 32nd and 33rd Parliaments; also, Caroline Di Cocco for Sarnia–Lambton in the 37th and 38th Parliaments. Also with us are members of the Ontario Association of Former Parliamentarians and students; I believe they are with former MPPs Gillies and Di Cocco.

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Question Period

Government accountability

10:37 a.m.Official Hansard

Ms. Marit Stiles

My question is for the Premier. Yesterday, this government voted against bringing in urgent financial relief to students who have been caught in the crosshairs of this Premier’s private college debacle. Students are being hung out to dry while this government is clearly in panic mode trying to cover their tracks. Academy of Learning, a private career college, has been raking in hundreds of millions of dollars in OSAP grants despite red flags being raised over and over again. The minister knew and did nothing for years, and people are asking me why, and I will tell you, there are some reasons, some indications of why—three executives behind the Academy of Learning donated over $11,000 to members of this government. To the Premier: Did your government look the other way because they wanted to keep raking in donations?

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10:38 a.m.Official Hansard

Hon. Nolan Quinn

As I said yesterday, the ministry was conducting its own investigations for two years into the career college sector. Once we realized that it was more widespread than initially thought—that is why we brought forward KPMG, a third-party expert auditor, to understand the impact across the sector. Speaker, these are bad actors who took advantage of taxpayer dollars for their intended use—they’re supposed to go towards students and bettering themselves in their education. Unfortunately, these are serious criminal allegations we’re speaking about here. These bad actors took advantage of all taxpayers right across Ontario. That is why we brought forward the third-party auditor to ensure that we can get the confidence back into the private institutions before we release another taxpayer dollar.

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10:40 a.m.Official Hansard

Ms. Marit Stiles

Back to the Premier: This is not a coincidence. It is a pattern of behaviour from this government. As long as the donations continued to flow, they turned a blind eye. And now they’re panicking and they’re punishing thousands and thousands of students across this province. Ministers from this government were actually celebrating the opening of that private career college. I sent a photo, by the way, over to the Premier yesterday, and he ripped it up. Well, I’ve got to tell you something. Guess what? That’s not how this works. I’ve got lots of copies, okay? I want to say to the Premier again, was the government simply waiting for private career colleges to hit the maximum donation before taking action against fraud?

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10:40 a.m.Official Hansard

Hon. Nolan Quinn

I’m not sure how that member can say we’ve turned a blind eye when, since 2020, we’ve done over 3,200 OSAP inspections into individual OSAP accounts. These are bad actors we’re speaking about. Again, I will remind the member opposite of the time frame: In late 2024, we saw an increased amount of OSAP applications at career colleges. In January 2025, Career Colleges Ontario, a third-party agency, saw the same concerns that we saw in late 2024. In May 2025, the federal government gave us the results of their own inspection, which had my ministry do enhanced, targeted inspections in July 2025. I’m not sure how we’re said to be turning a blind eye when, this year, we eliminated the eligibility of six of those institutions prior to pausing OSAP across the whole sector—because we realize it really is widespread, and we need to ensure that taxpayer dollars are being utilized for their intended purpose: to help students advance their education.

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10:42 a.m.Official Hansard

Ms. Marit Stiles

Speaker, this government opened the floodgates and then they raked in the donations from these executives. They were warned. They knew that there were red flags all over this, and they chose to ignore it. That minister chose to ignore it. This government’s incompetence is costing taxpayers hundreds of millions of dollars, and it is burying the next generation in debt. The single mom in Windsor who’s going back to school to become a PSW to support her family, the northern paramedic who wants to work in his community—these are the people who are being forced to pay for your failures. Red flag after red flag—but the PC donors at the Academy of Learning kept getting their grants. So I’d like to ask the Premier: When are you going to fire this minister and actually bring in somebody competent to fix this problem?

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10:43 a.m.Official Hansard

Hon. Nolan Quinn

I understand the impact this has on the good students. I’ve read thousands of emails. I’ve spoken to students on the phone as well. I’m not too sure she understands the impact on taxpayer dollars right now. Speaker, we’ve referred this to the OPP and to the Auditor General. In the coming weeks, we’re introducing further legislation to bring more guardrails into the private institution sector. We’re going to require all private institutions to meet stricter criteria for OSAP eligibility. We’re going to ensure that every single taxpayer dollar is spent properly and in the best interest of students, because that is the premise of OSAP. While this is a serious course of action, we needed to take this, because these are taxpayer dollars that have been fraudulently used by bad actors across the system. This is a serious criminal allegation. I can’t repeat that enough. As much as the opposition trivializes and makes this about myself— Interjection.

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10:44 a.m.Official Hansard

Hon. Nolan Quinn

—as the member of the third party is laughing—these are serious criminal allegations, and I won’t rest until we bring them to account.

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10:44 a.m.Official Hansard

Ms. Marit Stiles

I’ll just say that that minister’s tea and tears and sympathy are not going to pay the bills for those students. And I’m not surprised that the minister is doubling down, unfortunately, on this, because it is a pattern. Last week, we learned that the member from Haliburton–Kawartha Lakes–Brock promised government favours for the clients of a now-banned lobbyist, John Mutton, as long as they could pony up some cash for the Premier’s fundraiser. Don’t take it from me; take it from her, in her own words: “Do you think you could get a couple of your people especially the people we just helped to buy a few tickets for (the) March 2nd event? They have to go thru my portal so I get credit.” So, to the Premier: Is the only way to get this government’s attention and get on your agenda to buy your way into it?

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10:45 a.m.Official Hansard

Hon. Rob Flack

Speaker, as you know, what the member opposite is talking about is not true. We have ministerial zoning orders in place. Frameworks are in place. Protections are in place. They are diligently followed and will continue to be diligently followed. The bottom line is that we will continue on this path—end of subject.

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10:45 a.m.Official Hansard

Ms. Marit Stiles

Speaker, just to be very clear, that was a text from that member that was tabled, and it was part of the Integrity Commissioner’s investigation. If it happens one time, it’s a coincidence, but if it keeps happening over and over again, it is a pattern. We all know that with this government, the rot starts at the top. Unlike the Premier’s phone records, the public has full access to the text messages between John Mutton and that member opposite. But even she knew that if you want to cash in on your favours, you have to go through the Premier. She went on to encourage Mr. X to give the Premier a “nudge.” We’ll never know whether he did or not, because guess what? The Premier changed the law to make sure we will never find out, by burying his cellphone records. Protect Ontario? It’s more like “protect the Premier.” Back to the Premier: Can the Premier tell the people of Ontario if he exchanged favours for donations to their party?

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10:46 a.m.Official Hansard

Hon. Rob Flack

That is why, in April 2024, we introduced the new zoning order framework centred around a transparent intake process. It’s working. That is why we are focused diligently every day to build more homes and more homes faster. And guess what, Speaker? The program is working. Just released today—I want to point out that through an independent study, we have seen great action. In fact, year to date, through the third quarter, we’ve seen new home sales up, starts up, 93%; 60,490 new homes, thanks to the HST pause and the rebate. It’s working. We’re going to continue along this path.

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10:47 a.m.Official Hansard

Ms. Marit Stiles

Let’s be very clear: This was never about building homes or making affordable homes available to people. It could not be clearer. The member opposite told a lobbyist to “get a couple of your people” that “we just helped” to buy those tickets to the Premier’s fundraising dinner. And what was the help? It was handing over an MZO, carving up the province so developers could continue to make massive profits off the backs of regular people. Developers profit, and the Premier’s party cashes in. Students worried about making tuition payments, health care workers getting laid off, patients waiting for care in hallways, anybody who ever dreamed about one day owning a home—they are sweet out of luck, because they don’t have thousands of dollars to donate to this Premier and his party. This kind of pay-to-play scheme is what brought down the previous Liberal government. How many fundraiser tickets is it going to take for the people of Ontario to get on this Premier’s agenda?

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10:48 a.m.Official Hansard

Hon. Rob Flack

Well, I’m glad we’re talking about housing starts, because our program is working. The HST rebate is working. The DCRP, Development Charge Reduction Program, is working and will work even more in the future. Since last year, we’ve passed three bills: 17, 60 and 98. Why? To reduce the time and cost it takes to get shovels in the ground. And we’re seeing those results come through. We paused the HST for 12 months—the pause in the HST—and as I said earlier, up significantly since we announced it April 1. We’re seeing the results—$8.8 billion in the Development Charge Reduction Program, across the program. Well over a hundred municipalities are going to benefit from this critical infrastructure investment for the next 10 years. The program we’re on is working. We have a housing affordability crisis. We’re doing everything we can do to change the conditions to get more homes built faster. We’re on that path; we’re going to continue on that path because the path is working.

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Student assistance

10:50 a.m.Official Hansard

Mr. John Fraser

My question is for the Premier. Last week, the Minister of Colleges and Universities was touting the Learn and Stay grant while he was defending this OSAP scam. And today we learned that students at the CTS campus in Sault Ste. Marie who were approved and promised a Learn and Stay grant got the rug pulled out from underneath them, just like thousands and thousands of honest, hard-working Ontarians. Forty students have dropped out of the program—a program in northern Ontario, a program where health care workers like paramedics are really badly needed. And just to be clear: Because of the minister’s failure to act—this government’s failure to act—over a period of four years, thousands and thousands of hard-working, honest people are being cut off at the knees. So my question, Speaker, through you, to the minister is, when is the nightmare that he has created for these thousands and thousands of people going to end?

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10:51 a.m.Official Hansard

Hon. Nolan Quinn

Speaker, let’s remember what happened here: Bad actors took advantage of Ontario taxpayers and defrauded the Ontario taxpayer and unfortunately used OSAP dollars not for their intended use. We brought in the Ontario Provincial Police once we realized how widespread this issue was. Ultimately, we need to ensure that there is confidence in the OSAP system across the private institutions. That is why we brought in forensic experts from KPMG to do their important work to ensure that we can bring confidence back to the OSAP system. Again, I will not forget to remind the member opposite about how we got here. It was bad actors who brought us to this position. We did over 3,200 individual OSAP inspections over the last six years. We have not been sitting on our hands. We take every single tip very seriously, and we thoroughly investigate every single tip that the ministry receives.

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10:52 a.m.Official Hansard

Mr. John Fraser

There’s a lot of bad acting going on. Yes, there were bad actors, but there’s a government that failed to act, and that’s why we’re here today. Aaron Madgett is one of those students I mentioned. He was laid off from Algoma Steel. He was approved for the Learn and Stay grant, and he wanted to become a paramedic. Here’s what he had to say: “It kind of ripped away all the goals and aspirations that I had for me and my family, and I was gutted at the time.” He is now behind on property tax, electricity payments, and he has been making use of the food bank. Speaker, through you: Aaron has a family, just like the minister and I do. So my question to the minister is, when is this nightmare that this minister has created for Aaron and his family going to end?

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10:52 a.m.Official Hansard

Hon. Nolan Quinn

Again, these are serious allegations of fraud. We needed to bring it to the KPMG auditors to bring back confidence into the system. But what we uncovered through our investigations left our government no other choice but to act—all funding to private institutions, to protect taxpayer dollars and hold bad actors accountable. There is only one private institution that is eligible for the Ontario Learn and Stay Grant, as the Ontario Learn and Stay Grant has a separate, rigorous accountability process in place, including in-person instruction and return-of-service commitments. Work is currently under way to reassess OLSG eligibility at this specific institution. The OLSG continues to support thousands of students across the sector studying in health care programs at publicly assisted colleges.

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10:53 a.m.Official Hansard

Mr. John Fraser

Every member in this House on that side and on this side knows a story like Aaron’s, and if they don’t, they just need to check their inbox—and I suggest, Minister, that you check yours. You have let them down. They’re people just trying to get ahead, to do better, to make more money so they can feed their families, so their families have a future. You’re making life harder for them. The electricity bill can’t wait, the rent can’t wait, the mortgage can’t wait, the grocery bill can’t wait, but for some reason, this government believes they can wait. It’s unbelievable. It’s out of touch with people’s everyday lives. You’re making it harder for them. You’re making them wait. This is just so wrong—what’s happening to these families. When is this minister going to make it end for these thousands and thousands of honest, hard-working people in Ontario?

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10:54 a.m.Official Hansard

Hon. Nolan Quinn

Speaker, I am reading every single email that comes into my constituency office. I’m phoning the students, and I understand the impact online. I truly understand the impact this is having on the good, legitimate students. But these are serious allegations. I need to have confidence in the system. Bad actors have defrauded the Ontario taxpayer significantly, and we need to ensure that the taxpayer dollars are going towards their intended use. Once we realized that it wasn’t just the six institutions that we removed eligibility from, we knew we had to act urgently and fast to ensure that no more taxpayer dollars are flowing to criminal actors. This is something that we needed to take seriously, and it’s something that we did take seriously. After years and years of multiple investigations into individual institutions, we realized how widespread this was. That is why we’re working as urgently as possible with the third-party auditor to ensure that we’re able to have the confidence to flow taxpayer dollars and OSAP dollars back to the students who deserve those dollars.

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Government accountability

10:55 a.m.Official Hansard

Ms. Lee Fairclough

Speaker, every day, new revelations emerge about the nearly-billion-dollar OSAP scandal. We know that seven private career colleges received $385 million in OSAP grants in 2024-25. Thousands of applications came from single IP addresses. The government received repeated warnings about potential fraud dating back to 2023, and Career Colleges Ontario told the ministry to call the police in 2024. And the federal government even warned them that something was very wrong. Yet the money kept flowing. Yesterday, I brought forward a motion calling on the Auditor General to independently investigate this scandal. The Ford Conservatives voted it down. My question to the Premier: If your government has nothing to hide, why are you blocking an independent investigation by the Auditor General into what went wrong with hundreds of millions of dollars?

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10:56 a.m.Official Hansard

Hon. Nolan Quinn

Speaker, as I’ve stated in this House many times, the Auditor General was notified in early October—even though the third party wants to make this a partisan issue. As the third party knows, the Auditor General investigates a referral as she sees fit. These are very serious allegations, and we need to take them seriously, and that is why we brought forward KPMG. They’re the forensic experts. They are there on the ground, investigating the institutions, so that we can bring back confidence to the private institutions right across Ontario. That’s why the Ontario Provincial Police have been notified of this, and it has been referred to them because this is very serious. They can trivialize it all they want, but these are serious allegations of criminal fraud that we took very seriously. After years of individual investigations, we understood how widespread it was. They may not understand how widespread it is. That’s why we needed to bring forward the third-party auditor—to bring back confidence into the system that we all know and trusted for years.

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10:57 a.m.Official Hansard

Ms. Lee Fairclough

Speaker, this isn’t good enough. The government is hiding behind a review by KPMG. Do we even know if their work has begun? Do we know what the scope of that work is—the public won’t, actually, because that report will only go to government members; it will be a secret. The government will hide behind it, and their changes to the freedom-of-information laws made that possible for them. We have seen this movie before—the Skills Development Fund, the greenbelt. They warranted Auditor General reviews. Before entering politics, I led a large organization. I was taught that you listen to warnings, especially about potential fraud. But the minister had years of warnings and failed to act. Speaker, to the Premier: Why is the government hiding and refusing a review by the Auditor General at this moment?

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10:58 a.m.Official Hansard

Hon. Nolan Quinn

As I’ve said, we take every single tip very seriously, and we act upon those tips. But again, let’s make this about the bad actors who got us here. We received over 3,200 tips towards OSAP usage, and we investigated those. That is why we’re bringing forward legislation this session to ensure that we have the appropriate guardrails to push back against the bad actors who have defrauded the Ontario taxpayer. We’ve seen third parties completing coursework on behalf of students in a single day. We’ve seen exams done in six minutes. These supposed students couldn’t even identify the institution they attended or the course they took. Speaker, this is very serious. Regardless of if the opposition wants to acknowledge the seriousness of this, we will continue to ensure that the appropriate action is taken on this file. That’s why KPMG—yes, KPMG—has started their investigation with ministry investigators. It is currently active right now. I will reassure you that KPMG is on site at these institutions, doing the work that’s required to bring confidence back to the OSAP system.

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11:00 a.m.Official Hansard

Ms. Lee Fairclough

Speaker, all that I am asking for here is that the government be accountable to the public. That’s the job of elected officials. Thousands of students were blamed for the OSAP program, and their funds were frozen. It was only when the media uncovered that something was very wrong that the minister acted. It was clear that a handful of private colleges had abused hundreds of millions of dollars. Only then did we hear about KPMG or the OPP being called, after years of warning. Surely others—the Minister of Finance, the President of the Treasury Board, the House leader—can see that this OSAP program mess needs a full review. Speaker, to the Premier: Will you do what’s right and accept an immediate review by the Auditor General?

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11:00 a.m.Official Hansard

Hon. Nolan Quinn

Speaker, as I’ve already said, we referred this to the Auditor General in early October, and the Auditor General can see fit if she wants to investigate the referral that we’ve brought there. But again, I will repeat this, and I will repeat this and I will repeat this again: This is about the bad actors, whether you want to listen to what it is about. Unfortunately, that’s on them. The bad actors have defrauded the Ontario taxpayers. These are extremely serious allegations of criminal fraud that we have to take seriously. That is why we’ve ensured that KPMG has the information that’s needed, the data that’s needed to be able to bring back confidence to the Ontario government and the OSAP system. For that member to say that we took the investigations not seriously enough—I can’t take that, because ultimately, we have done years of investigations into the sector. But once we realized how widespread it was, we brought forward KPMG and the third-party auditor, because we understood the widespread nature of the fraud allegations, and we’ve taken them very seriously since day one. We take every single tip seriously, and we’ll continue to do—

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11:02 a.m.Official Hansard

MPP Jamie West

This morning, the Canadian Press reported that 40 paramedic students have dropped out and there are dozens more at risk of leaving. This is because the province abruptly ended the Learn and Stay grant for the paramedic training programs. Just yesterday, the minister boasted that this program was helping people train for in-demand professions, so imagine my shock when I read the news this morning. We also learned through the news that the Better Jobs Ontario program, a program that helps unemployed people train for new professions, was also paused. That was the program meant to help people get off social assistance and into the workforce. Speaker, the Conservative government is leaving thousands of people without any certainty or support. Will the Premier confirm if the Learn and Stay grant and Better Jobs Ontario programs are paused and how long students in training institutions must wait for an update?

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11:03 a.m.Official Hansard

Hon. Trevor Jones

Workers deserve training that leads to real opportunities. Our responsibility is to make sure the programs we invest in actually deliver on those results. Following serious allegations raised about OSAP, our government is actually taking action. Other streams of provincial funding to private institutions—both past and present—are currently under review, as the member knows. Again, it’s our job to maintain and protect the integrity of the system so we can make investments that create real results. That’s exactly what we’re doing.

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11:04 a.m.Official Hansard

MPP Jamie West

Speaker, the minister talks about integrity, but we’re finding out about this in the news, not from them. Just yesterday, the minister bragged about this program, and now he’s pausing the very program he bragged about yesterday, with no explanation and no plan for the students who are being affected. The Conservative government is pulling the rug out from under people who are trying to build a better life. Parents with young kids who are going to school to support their families; young people who want to go into the trades, like HVAC, because that’s what the government and the minister told them to do; people who lost their jobs and are training for new professions, like Aaron in Sault Ste. Marie, who lost his job at Algoma Steel and wants to become a paramedic—this is who the collateral damage is, because of the government’s incompetence. My question is, when will the Premier admit that his minister’s incompetence is costing thousands of Ontarians their future and finally fire this minister?

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11:05 a.m.Official Hansard

Hon. Trevor Jones

Every dollar we invest in training is an investment in someone’s future. These are real people. We know these real people. That comes with a responsibility, as a government, to spend those dollars wisely. I take that responsibility seriously. The member opposite knows we’re making clear investments in people’s futures, because the member from Sudbury is very happy to pose in front of a press release, at a conference, in his community that we’re investing in—like the mine rescue centre in Sudbury: a $125-million investment in people’s futures and safe working environments in our north. That’s why we’re conducting additional due diligence into Better Jobs Ontario and other provincial funding streams: to make sure those investments are done for people’s futures.

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Hospital funding

11:06 a.m.Official Hansard

Mr. Stephen Blais

My question is for the Minister of Finance. Last week, under my questioning, the government finally admitted that the cost of Ottawa’s new Civic hospital is approaching a 500% increase to the original estimate. The Ottawa community has already been asked to find $700 million locally, from private fundraising and from a $150-million request to property taxpayers. Ottawa cannot afford that bill to multiply by 500% because of this government’s mismanagement. Will the government guarantee today that the original local share will be capped and that the province will cover the increase instead of passing it on to Ottawa property taxpayers?

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11:06 a.m.Official Hansard

Hon. David Piccini

This hospital investment in Ottawa is a game-changer for the delivery of quality care for the residents of Ottawa. The member references project estimates and a conceptual design that were pre-COVID, pre-tariff war, pre-war in Iran. The member knows nothing about construction. He has voted against every single investment in health care in his community. In fact, he voted against this very hospital in his own city. Shame on him. Interjections.

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11:07 a.m.Official Hansard

Mr. Stephen Blais

Unless the minister is hiding the final cost of the hospital in the budget somewhere, we haven’t voted against anything. Ottawa property taxpayers and donors need certainty about what they will be expected to pay for the Civic hospital. The mayor has already said that the city cannot afford billions in additional costs for the local share. A more expensive hospital should not mean the loss of recreation centres or public transit projects or new roads. Hospital construction is a provincial responsibility, and Ottawa residents already pay provincial taxes. Ottawa residents pay provincial income taxes that have never been cut. They pay provincial sales taxes that have never been cut. They cannot afford a new Ford property tax to cover this government’s inability to manage construction costs. Will the minister make a clear commitment today, in writing, that Ottawa’s local share will be covered by the government of Ontario and they will not be asked to pay more? Will he make that guarantee to Ottawa today?

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11:08 a.m.Official Hansard

Hon. David Piccini

The guarantee we’ve made to the people of Ottawa is, after years of dithering and delay, we’re getting a hospital done for the people of Ottawa that’s going to deliver better care—$64 billion that that member voted against in successive budgets, fall economic statements—to ensure Ontarians get better care closer to home. We’re investing in more nurse training, new medical schools. And at each and every step, that member has voted against it. We’ll take no lessons in health care from that member. The people of Ottawa know that under Premier Ford and this government, they’re going to get better care closer to home.

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Northern Ontario development

11:09 a.m.Official Hansard

MPP Bill Rosenberg

My question is for the Minister of Northern Economic Development and Growth. I want to thank the minister for coming to Algoma–Manitoulin and area several times over the summer and for his great advocacy for northern Ontario. During a time of economic uncertainty and trade disruption, I look at northern Ontario as an opportunity for growth in our province. To support this growth, I know that our government has been hard at work with the Northern Ontario Heritage Fund Corp., helping to keep investment flowing. I recently saw that since our government took office, the NOHFC has supported over 9,000 projects, leveraging over $3.4 billion in investment, creating over 11,500 jobs, and sustaining over 2,000 jobs across northern Ontario. Minister, how is our government using this program to support businesses and strengthen key sectors in northern Ontario while creating jobs and supporting long-term growth?

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11:10 a.m.Official Hansard

Hon. George Pirie

Speaker, I want to thank the member for his question and his tireless advocacy for northern Ontario—and when I say “tireless,” it’s an understatement. This member has travelled over 26,000 kilometres this summer, in his riding and across Sault Ste. Marie. He is a true champion. The NOHFC is one of the government’s key tools for supporting economic development and growth. In the forestry sector alone, our government, through the NOHFC, has invested $64 million in over 350 projects, leveraging $280 million in investment, and helped to create and sustain over 1,400 jobs. The NOHFC has invested over $31 million in 37 tile drainage projects since taking office, improving 50,000 acres of agricultural land in northern Ontario. It’s in a place we’re actually growing. We are also supporting the development of our critical minerals supply chain, with over $100 million invested in over—

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11:11 a.m.Official Hansard

MPP Bill Rosenberg

Recent disruptions show that we cannot take access to markets for granted, making it more important than ever to build resilience right here at home. By supporting key industries, expanding domestic supply chains and investing in strategic infrastructure, our government is helping communities pivot away from our reliance on the US. These investments are creating opportunities today while building the foundation for long-term prosperity across the north. Minister, you have outlined how the NOHFC is supporting important sectors of our economy. Can you share some examples of specific projects that help build a stronger and more self-reliant northern Ontario?

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11:12 a.m.Official Hansard

Hon. George Pirie

Speaker, the member is right; the need for resilient supply chains has never been clearer. That is why, alongside the Premier, I announced more than $2.8 million in NOHFC funding for the new and upgraded port facilities in Marathon and Thunder Bay. If we’re going to pivot away from dependence on the US markets, we’ve got to get our product out to market. That’s why we’re investing in these ports. These investments strengthen Ontario’s transportation network and expand trade opportunities, with most cargo through the Port of Thunder Bay destined for markets beyond the US. This announcement received a lot of support, including from the opposition. Also in Thunder Bay, we invested $500,000 in Greenwater Technology to build a demonstration plant that will convert underused wood by-products to diesel and aviation fuel, creating 20 new jobs—and this is a pilot project. When this is fully built, we’ll be building these plants in Thunder Bay and Chapleau and Timmins and all across the north. I am pleased to say the plant’s construction is almost complete. Our government—

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Community use of schools

11:13 a.m.Official Hansard

Mr. Chris Glover

My question is to the Premier. Simon Rogers has been running a basketball program at Central Tech collegiate for more than a decade, but this September, he discovered that this Conservative government had tripled the cost of his permit, from $3,400 to $10,000. Community groups; sports organizations; community theatre groups; even philharmonic orchestras, like the Etobicoke Philharmonic Orchestra, have used our schools in the evenings and on weekends, after the kids leave. But suddenly, this fall, the government jacked up the permit rates, pricing many organizations out of existence. Why is this government trying to prevent community organizations from using the schools that they have built with their own taxes?

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11:14 a.m.Official Hansard

Hon. Paul Calandra

As you know, Madam Speaker, community use of schools is something that is very important not only in the city of Toronto, but across the province of Ontario. That’s why the ministry is working very hard to facilitate greater access to our school infrastructure. Of course, in the city of Toronto, one of the challenges that we had at the Toronto District School Board—and a couple of other boards with significant deficits—was that they were running these programs at a significant loss. What we have asked them to do, of course, is to get themselves into a break-even position, where the cost of running the program is the cost of the school. As you know, there are a number of contracts in place. Whether it’s with respect to how many janitors should be in the school, how many hours—those are all things that were bargained by the previous Toronto District School Board trustees. It just did not make sense for these programs to run at the significant costs they were running at, taking money out of the classroom. Madam Speaker, as you know, we’re focused on putting more money back in the classroom to support students, and we’ll continue to do that.

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11:15 a.m.Official Hansard

Mr. Chris Glover

Before I became an MPP, I was a trustee at the Toronto District School Board, and I was chair of the Community Use of Schools Community Advisory Committee. More than a decade ago, we created permits that were on a cost-recovery basis. So the allegation you’re making that these were costing the board is absolutely false. What has happened this year is, this government is now charging for custodial fees. They’re double- and triple- charging different groups at the same school at the same time for the same custodian. So you fabricated a way of jacking up these rates and pushing the community groups out of the—

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11:16 a.m.Official Hansard

The Speaker (Hon. Donna Skelly)

A reminder to direct your questions and responses through the Speaker. I recognize the Minister of Education.

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11:16 a.m.Official Hansard

Hon. Paul Calandra

Need I say any more, Madam Speaker? The member of the NDP was a trustee in charge of the board that ran at a significant loss. Not only that program, but he decided that in his wisdom—and the Leader of the Opposition, of course, was also a trustee. Under their leadership, what happened? Student achievement, every single year, went down—reading down, writing down, math down, school maintenance down. Every measurement that a parent and a teacher looks at for success, under the leadership of the NDP and the Liberals—not only here, when they were in government, but when they ran the reign of destruction over school boards across the province of Ontario—was one of loss for students. Now, under our government—billions of dollars more in, putting more money back into the classroom. Student success and achievement is the focus of the Ministry of Education, and they hate it, but we like it because we know parents, students and teachers want achievement to be at the top of the list—and we’re going to continue to do that. No wonder it was such a bad mess. I didn’t know you were a trustee as well.

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Health care funding

11:17 a.m.Official Hansard

Ms. Mary-Margaret McMahon

Speaker, let me tell you about a wonderful and widely loved 59-year-old named Kevin Nash, who is here today in the chamber. Kevin has a love for the outdoors and a zeal for life, spending as much time as he can with his loving family in Haliburton. Tragically, Kevin was diagnosed with melanoma and underwent several surgeries, immunotherapy, and radiation at Princess Margaret hospital. Unfortunately, these treatments exhausted the options covered by OHIP. Kevin tried to access tumour-infiltrating lymphocyte—TIL—trials in other countries to no avail. Princess Margaret and Iovance worked to find a solution, but OHIP did not engage. Bristol Myers Squibb offered new immunotherapy at a reduced price, yet OHIP refused. Kevin’s oncologist believes TIL therapy offers the best hope. My question is to the Premier. The doctors, the hospitals and the drug companies are doing their jobs. When will you step up and do yours?

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11:19 a.m.Official Hansard

Mr. Anthony Leardi

Of course, anybody facing the terrible disease of cancer and other related diseases has a very, very serious challenge to face— Interjections.

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